CONTACTS
SUBJECTS
Knee Pain Worse Complications Surgery 120322 Evidence MRI Radiology
1003 -
1003 - ..
1004 - Summary/Objective
1005 -
100501 - Follow up ref SDS 17 0000. ref SDS 16 0000.
100502 -
100503 -
100504 -
100505 -
100507 - ..
1006 -
1007 -
1008 - Progress
1009 -
100901 - Case Management Performed without Patient Assistance
100902 - Medical Records No Evidence Ordered from Lawler for 2nd Opinions
100903 -
100904 - Follow up ref SDS 17 CM3V, ref SDS 16 CM3V.
100905 -
100906 - Robin did not call last night about getting medical records from
100907 - Doctor Lawler, planned in the call yesterday on 120726 0753.
100908 - ref SDS 17 CM3V, and to prepare for meetings with Lawler on 120731,
100909 - with Doctor Scheuchler on 120802, and with Doctor Fow on 120830.
100911 - ..
100912 - MRI report on right knee performed 120217, cites pior radiography
100913 - study on 111213, so need this study to analyse rate of changes in the
100914 - knee, cited on 120726 0753. ref SDS 17 QQ8V
100916 - ..
100917 - Submitted letter to Robin saying...
100918 -
100919 - 1. Subject: Radiograph Right Knee 13 December 2011
100920 - Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2012 09:20:06 -0700
100927 - ..
100928 - 2. Forgot to ask last night [...in letter to Robin on 120726 0753
100929 - at 2329, ref SDS 17 647L...], if you can submit prior scan for
100930 - right knee on 111213 [...shown in MRI study on 120217, and
100931 - received last night on 120726 0753. ref SDS 17 QQ8V...] to
100932 - compare rate of change between December 2011 to February 2012
100933 - [...120726 0753, ref SDS 17 QQ9L...], and recent study
100934 - postoperative on 120717. [...received in the record on 120726
100935 - 0753, ref SDS 17 185I...].
100937 - ..
100938 - 3. Do you think it might be possible for Doctor Vernacchia to meet
100939 - with us on Monday before or after work or early Tuesday and
100940 - show us the scans with a verbal explanation - answer a few
100941 - questions - would take about 15 minutes to clarify official
100942 - reports.
100944 - ..
100945 - 4. I'll call this morning and leave a cell phone message as well.
100946 -
100947 - [...below on 120727 0912 at 0928 called Robin and left
100948 - message on these issues. ref SDS 0 6W3N
100950 - ..
100951 - 5. Hope you're feeling better.
100952 -
100959 -
100960 -
100962 - ..
1010 -
1011 -
1012 - 0938
1013 -
101301 - Called and left message for Robin on letter per above. ref SDS 0 4K9K
101302 -
101303 -
101305 - ..
1014 -
1015 -
1016 - 1843
1017 -
101701 - Received letter from Robin saying...
101702 -
101703 - 1. Subject: Re: Radiograph Right Knee 13 December 2011
101704 - Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2012 18:18:09 -0700 (PDT)
101711 - ..
101712 - 2. Thank you for your efforts in reviewing my reports, calling me
101713 - and encouraging/supporting me in regard to my knees, truly
101714 - means a lot:) Yes, I am very perplexed as to why/how I've
101715 - gotten degenerative arthritis in both of my knees.
101717 - ..
101718 - 3. The chiropractor never treated my knees and the PT, only saw
101719 - him 3 times and didn't do anything aggressive.
101721 - ..
101722 - 4. I did speak briefly with Dr Vernacchia, told him about dancing,
101723 - prolotherapy injections I had years ago and he said I didn't do
101724 - anything to cause it, that it is an inherited weakness, we all
101725 - have them in some form or another.
101727 - ..
101728 - 5. Dr Vernacchia also said NOT to have surgery if my knees don't
101729 - bother me or give me pain. Dr Vernacchia said you don't treat
101730 - the MRI.
101732 - ..
101733 - 6. Dr Vernacchia said that I need to do conditioning exercises to
101734 - strengthen and support my knees.
101736 - ..
101737 - 7. OKAY, I'm going to make a diligent effort to get to the gym,
101738 - ride the stationary bike, do my exercises consistently and take
101739 - the joint liquid daily that you were so generous and thoughtful
101740 - to send to me:)
101741 -
101742 - [On 120728 0027 letter to Robin advises hiking has proven
101743 - effective to strengthen coronary system, while increasing
101744 - range of motion following knee surgery. ref SDS 18 RL9Y
101745 -
101747 - ..
101748 - Knees Not Painful Significant Improvement
101749 -
101750 -
101751 - 8. My knees at present don't bother me, are not painful, a bit
101752 - stiff in the morning, takes awhile for them to loosen up.
101753 - However, my surgery knee isn't painful when I'm in bed and roll
101754 - over like it was. Of course I have limited flexibility
101755 - especially the knee I had surgery on.
101757 - ..
101758 - This representation is unclear, saying both "knees" are not painful,
101759 - then saying the right knee that was treated with surgery on 120322,
101760 - and which Robin has been complaining is painful, e.g., on 120718 1842.
101761 - ref SDS 13 MI5I, since surgery on 120322, "isn't painful when ...in
101762 - bed," which seems to imply it hurts when not in bed.
101763 -
101764 - [On 120728 0027 letter to Robin confirms understanding that
101765 - knee pain has subsided in both knees. ref SDS 18 RL9V
101767 - ..
101768 - 9. I did e-mail my reports to Dr Ongley in Ensenada Mexico [...
101769 - referencing Robin's letter on 120726, shown below, ref SDS 0
101770 - OP4K...], and he replied stating that his treatment of
101771 - injections would help my knees and that altho they have
101772 - arthritis, they are NOT beyond help. [...referencing the
101773 - doctor's letter, also, shown below. ref SDS 0 OP4K...].
101775 - ..
101776 - 10. Oh, by the way, the plain x-ray taken of my right knee in 12/11
101777 - prior to the MRI read normal other than minimal narrowing of
101778 - joint space. X-rays don't show much of what is going on with
101779 - the soft tissues, mainly bone.
101781 - ..
101782 - 11. My recent bone density showed I have above average bone
101783 - density, yay, 1 point for me!!
101785 - ..
101786 - 12. My appointment with Dr Lawler is Tues and my girlfriend Carol
101787 - is going to pick my up from work and take me. I have questions
101788 - I will write down so I don't forget what to ask.
101790 - ..
101791 - 13. Then Thurs I'm going to see Dr Schueckler for a second opinion.
101792 - Both Lawler and Schueckler and highly respected for treating
101793 - knees.
101795 - ..
101796 - 14. I also need to take Omega 3 supplement which I have along with
101797 - what you sent me. I will go to the gym tomorrow and ride the
101798 - bike for 30 minutes without resistance. PLEASE don't hesitate
101799 - to get after me...haha
101801 - ..
101802 - 15. Rod,THANK YOU, THANK YOU for all of your words of care and
101803 - concern, means SO much!!
101805 - ..
101806 - 16. I was going to call you tonight, however, the OLYMPICS opening
101807 - ceremonies is on....gotta watch all those soon to be KNEES
101808 - strut their stuff!!! HAHAHA!!
101810 - ..
101811 - 17. I will call you this weekend for sure :)
101813 - ..
101814 - 18. Hope you are doing well. I am encouraged by what you told me
101815 - in regard to your knee and what you've done to avoid surgery
101816 - and all the hiking you do, WOW!! You give me HOPE!! I don't
101817 - want my knees replaced:(
101819 - ..
101820 - 19. HAVE A WONDERFUL EVENING and we chat soon!
101821 -
101826 -
101827 -
101829 - ..
1019 -
1020 -
1021 - 1909
1022 -
102201 - Received another letter from Robin saying...
102202 -
102203 - 1. Subject: MRI Reports
102204 - Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2012 18:18:58 -0700 (PDT)
102211 - ..
102212 - 2. Here is the reply I received from Dr. Ongley.
102213 -
102214 -
102215 - ************ Forwarded Message **********************
102217 - ..
102218 - 1. Subject: Re: MRI Reports
102219 - Sent: Friday, July 27, 2012 7:57 AM
102227 - ..
102228 - 2. It is nice to hear from old patients [...referencing Robin's
102229 - letter submitted yesterday, shown below. ref SDS 0 OP4K...].
102231 - ..
102232 - 3. I am not a great believer in the MRI----It does not tell the
102233 - complete story. It does in your case, however, [...
102234 - referencing Robin's letter transmitting MRI reports,
102235 - ref SDS 0 ST35...], indicate that you are suffering from
102236 - Degenerative Arthritis of both knees. The degree of
102237 - degeneration is NOT beyond the help from the injections.
102239 - ..
102240 - Doctor Ongley's finding of degenerative arthritis aligns with MRI
102241 - reports received from Robin yesterday on 120726 0753, ref SDS 17 NJ8H,
102242 - and reflects findings...
102243 -
102244 - 1. Right knee pre surgery
102245 - MRI on 120217....................... 120726 0753, ref SDS 17 QQ9L
102246 - 2. Right knee post surgery
102247 - MRI on 120717....................... 120726 0753, ref SDS 17 PB3M
102248 - Left knee MRI on 120723............. 120726 0753, ref SDS 17 QU3J
102250 - ..
102251 - [...below, Robin's letter transmitting MRI reports and
102252 - asking for advice on benefitting from Doctor Ongley's
102253 - treatment. ref SDS 0 ST3F
102255 - ..
102256 - 4. As before we treat the patient on two consecutive days
102257 - initially followed by one day treatments at approximately
102258 - weekly intervals on three more occasions.
102260 - ..
102261 - 5. Best wishes,
102263 - ..
102264 - 6. Milne Ongley.
102265 -
102266 -
102267 - *****************************************
102269 - ..
102270 - 1. On Thu, Jul 26, 2012 at 6:12 PM,
102276 - ..
102277 - 2. I previously was a patient of yours approximately 25 years ago.
102279 - ..
102280 - 3. I recently e-mailed you a few months ago regarding my neck.
102282 - ..
102283 - 4. However, in addition to my neck I also had pain in my knees,
102284 - specifically my right one. I did have surgery on my right knee
102285 - in March of this year.
102287 - ..
102288 - 5. I've attached the pre-op report dated 2/17/12 and the post op
102289 - report 7/17/12.
102291 - ..
102292 - Robin references MRI test reports submitted yesterday on 120726 0753.
102293 - ref SDS 17 NJ8H
102295 - ..
102296 - Robin's letter to Doctor Ongely continues...
102297 -
102298 - 6. I just had a MRI of my left knee, report attached 7/23/12 and
102299 - it looks grim: (I work at San Luis Diagnostic Center where I
102300 - had the MRI' taken, work in the business office.
102302 - ..
102303 - 7. I had had knee injections at your office in Newport Beach when
102304 - you were with Dr Bjorn Eek, a knee study I was elected to be
102305 - part of.
102307 - ..
102308 - 8. I hope that your injections again can help my knee problems.
102309 - Please read my reports and let me know since it isn't easy for
102310 - me to get to your clinic $ and distance. Of course I will make
102311 - the trip/drive if your treatment will help my knees to avoid
102312 - further surgery.
102314 - ..
102315 - 9. I look forward to hearing from you.
102316 -
102317 - [...answer to letter received today, shown above, saying
102318 - Doctor Ongley's treatment can help recover from
102319 - degenerative arthritis. ref SDS 0 HP9Q
102320 -
102328 -
102329 -
102331 - ..
1024 -
1025 -
1026 - 1922
1027 -
102701 - Received another letter from Robin saying...
102702 -
102703 - 1. Subject: look at this!
102704 - Date: Fri, 27 Jul 2012 18:40:17 -0700 (PDT)
102711 - ..
102712 - 2. Prolotherapy and cartilage rebuilding
102713 -
102714 - Jointrehab.com
102715 - Prolotherapy and PRP Information
102716 -
102717 - http://www.jointrehab.com/prolotherapy_rebuilds_cartilage.htm
102719 - ..
102720 - Degenerative Arthritis Removing Cartilage
102721 -
102722 - Removing tissue from your knee through surgical
102723 - intervention can only make your knee weaker in the long run
102724 - and prone to arthritis because removal of tissue decreases
102725 - the shock absorption capabilities built in to protect the
102726 - knee.
102727 -
102729 - ..
102730 - Robin's letter continues and cites an article...
102731 -
102732 - 3. This is what Dr Ongley does and what I had done when I was in
102733 - my late 20', interesting huh.
102734 -
102735 - Prolotherapy Rebuilds Cartilage
102738 - March 18, 2011 by Dr Marc Darrow, M.D.
102739 - Filed under Knee Pain, Prolotherapy Treatment Information
102740 -
102741 -
102742 - http://www.jointrehab.com/author/admin
102743 -
102744 - Dr Darrow emphasizes that inflammation means the body is
102745 - responding to an injury or stress to the joint by sending
102746 - cellular compounds to the damaged area. Its your bodys
102747 - way of getting the healing process started. Once these
102748 - cellular compounds have done their job, they are replaced
102749 - by fibroblasts, which begin repairing the damage and
102750 - forming granular tissue that will become new collagen.
102751 - Collagen is a major component of the connective tissue
102752 - found between tendons and ligaments.
102754 - ..
102755 - The article says Doctor Marc Darrow works at UCLA. The article
102756 - further says Doctor Andrew Kochan provides prolotherapy?
102758 - ..
102759 - Why then take chances and pay expense traveling to Doctor Ongely in
102760 - Ensenada, Mexico?
102761 -
102762 - [On 120728 0027 letter recommends Robin consider treatment
102763 - with Doctor Darrow rather than travel to Ensenada Mexico
102764 - for similar treatment with Doctor Ongely. ref SDS 18 RL4W
102766 - ..
102767 - [On 120728 0027 at 0935 Robin called and requested
102768 - assistance arranging for meeting with Doctor Darrow in Los
102769 - Angeles on providing prolotherapy to help Robin recover
102770 - from degenerative arthritis in her knees. ref SDS 18 QQ8H
102772 - ..
102773 - How Darrow's prolotherapy differ from treatment by Doctor Ongely?
102775 - ..
102776 - Robin's letter continues...
102777 -
102778 - 4. I realize that surgery isn't the answer, however, IF you have a
102779 - lot of loose tissue, it can accelerate the wearing down of the
102780 - cartilage.
102782 - ..
102783 - 5. I'm not going to have surgery but want to find out what Dr
102784 - Lawler and Schueckler say.
102786 - ..
102787 - 6. I am fortunate that I've been told by a former long term
102788 - employee of Dr Lawler', Lynn (whose husband had knee surgery by
102789 - Lawler) that Dr Lawler is VERY conservative when he does
102790 - surgery.
102792 - ..
102793 - 7. In fact when I saw him, time before last about my pain, Dr
102794 - Lawler told me that he removed very little and MAY not have
102795 - removed enough as to why I was having difficulty.
102797 - ..
102798 - Not removing enough causing continuing pain since surgery on 120322,
102799 - aligns with recent MRI on 120717, finding 2 remaining "tears" in knee
102800 - cartilage, reported in Robin's letter on 120726 0753. ref SDS 17 PB3M
102801 - and ref SDS 17 EZ4K
102802 -
102803 - [On 120728 0027 letter to Robin cites competing and
102804 - complementary theories on cause of persistent pain since
102805 - knee surgery on 120322, and citing sciatica pain from neck
102806 - and spine disorders, ref SDS 0 UV4J, and also Doctor Lawler
102807 - disclosing attempt to implement standard of care to avoid
102808 - removing too much torn cartilage, possibly resulting in not
102809 - removing enough, ref SDS 0 PS36, which aligns with MRI
102810 - report on 120717 showing 2 remaining tears in right knee
102811 - after corrective surgery on 120322, and thereby causing
102812 - continuing pain. ref SDS 18 RL4J
102813 -
102815 - ..
102816 - Sciatica Spinal Disorder Pain Travels Down Back to Knee Legs
102817 -
102818 -
102819 - 8. I realize now that it was in part due to Sciatica pain which
102820 - travels down around the outside of your knee. Anyway, I have
102821 - some basis now as to what I have and how care for it.
102822 -
102823 - [On 120728 0027 letter to Robin cites competing and
102824 - complementary theories on persistent cause of pain since
102825 - knee surgery on 120322, and citing sciatica from neck and
102826 - spine disorders. ref SDS 18 RL4J
102828 - ..
102829 - Sciatica is explained in wikipedia...
102830 -
102831 - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sciatica
102832 -
102833 - symptoms including pain that may be caused by general
102834 - compression or irritation of one of five spinal nerve
102835 - roots that give rise to each sciatic nerve, or by
102836 - compression or irritation of the left or right or both
102837 - sciatic nerves.
102839 - ..
102840 - The pain is felt in the lower back, buttock, or various
102841 - parts of the leg and foot. In addition to pain, which is
102842 - sometimes severe, there may be numbness, muscular weakness,
102843 - pins and needles or tingling and difficulty in moving or
102844 - controlling the leg.
102846 - ..
102847 - Robin's letter concludes...
102848 -
102849 - 9. Bye for now....:)
102850 -
102851 -
102852 -
102853 -
102854 -
102855 -
102856 -
102857 -
102858 -
102859 -
102860 -
102861 -
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102864 -
1029 -