CONTACTS 

SUBJECTS
Property Rights in Knowledge Organization
Commercial Viability
Ownership Investment Risk
Development Investment Risk
Open Source Development Freeware

0907 -
0907 -    ..
0908 - Summary/Objective
0909 -
090901 - Follow up ref SDS 21 3055, ref SDS 6 3055.
090902 -
090903 - Paul submits strong analysis showing challenge of fashioning an
090904 - effective open source business model.  RedHat and Zope are cited as
090905 - examples the DKR project should emulate. ref SDS 0 5933  He recommends
090906 - funding from foundations and government. ref SDS 0 3900   Allocation
090907 - of added value for continued innovation is not expressly addressed.
090908 - ref SDS 0 6762
090909 -
090910 -    [On 000423 Jeff Miller comments. ref SDS 23 3055
090911 -
090912 -
090913 -
090915 -  ..
0910 -
0911 -
0912 - Progress
091301 -  ..
091302 - Business License to Bring Revenue Conflict with Open Source Methods
091303 -
091304 - Received ref DRT 1 0001 from Paul Fernhout responding to Eric
091305 - Armstrong's first pass at addressing business issues, in his letter,
091306 - ref DRP 1 0001, received on 000421. ref SDS 21 3055
091307 -
091308 - Open Source development is a core planning issue set reviewed at the
091309 - initial proejct meeting. ref SDS 5 7371
091311 -  ..
091312 - Paul says...
091313 -
091314 -     "Open Source" (TM) Licenses cannot discriminate among classes of
091315 -     users, based on authority at...
091316 -
091317 -
091318 -         http://www.opensource.org
091319 -
091320 -
091321 -     ...and further "The Open Source Definition"....
091322 -
091324 -          ..
091325 -         http://www.opensource.org/osd.html
091326 -
091327 -     ..
091328 -     Paul notes that violating these guidelines would likely lose
091329 -     the participation of open source developers. ref DRT 1 3780  Paul
091330 -     does not support initial license ideas proposed by Eric on 000421.
091331 -     ref DRT 1 1332
091332 -
091333 -            [...below, Jon Winters concurs. ref SDS 0 1504
091334 -
091335 -         Question - who is following guidelines on open source now?
091337 -          ..
091338 -         What has been produced that moves the world forward under Open
091339 -         Source guidelines.
091341 -          ..
091342 -         On 000413 Mark Mitchel reported experience to the project team
091343 -         showing significant difficulties adhering to Open Source
091344 -         guidelines, and of completing projects using this business
091345 -         model. ref SDS 17 3055
091347 -          ..
091348 -         On 000203 Paul cited complexities of Open Source. ref SDS 4
091349 -         0001, set out in detail in the record on 000324 relating
091350 -         issues with SRI. ref SDS 5 3055
091351 -         ..
091352 -         Accordingly, complex guidelines imply a range of
091353 -         permissible conduct, in contrast to legal requirements,
091354 -         violation of which is actionable.  How can the DKR team
091355 -         accomodate key talent like Paul, and still formulate the
091356 -         organization structure and leadership required to focus talent
091357 -         and other resources for the hard work of creating things for
091358 -         which there no settled approach, per project planning on
091359 -         000324? ref SDS 5 4729
091361 -            ..
091362 -           [On 000423 Eric makes similar point. ref SDS 23 2214
091363 - ..
091364 - Paul continues...
091365 -
091366 -     One can make money from open source software if that is one's
091367 -     goal. You just can't do it by selling the right to use the source
091368 -     or resultant binaries of the core distribution. You can't live in
091369 -     both worlds with a core codebase. Sun is trying it with Java and
091370 -     failing compared to what Java could have been. ref DRT 1 6545
091371 -
091372 -         Question -- who is making money following the guidelines?  On
091373 -         000411 report that initial interest in this method has begun
091374 -         to wane. ref SDS 14 5956
091376 -            ..
091377 -           [On 000423 Eric makes same point. ref SDS 23 5280
091379 -      ..
091380 -     Paul recommends against making money from selling stuff being a
091381 -     primary goal. ref DRT 1 5280
091382 -
091383 -         Comment -- Review on 931130, Peter Drucker notes profit is
091384 -         essential to make better stuff, by covering the risk of
091385 -         continual bumbling using present practices. ref SDS 1 1199
091387 -          ..
091388 -         Innovation is derived fro profits. ref SDS 1 8955
091390 -      ..
091391 -     If money is an issue, there are foundations and governments with
091392 -     billions of dollars spent annually on efforts less worthwhile than
091393 -     what is proposed here. ref DRT 1 1750
091395 -      ..
091396 -     On 000406 DKR team discussed producing a program for software
091397 -     programming, along the lines set out by Eric Armstrong on 000227
091398 -     to explain how to gain acceptance.  A tool that improves the work
091399 -     typically saves money, i.e., adds value, and that requires
091400 -     payment. ref SDS 11 6004
091401 -
091402 -         Question -- what if the government agent is too busy to click
091403 -         on a link, reported on 991213, ref SDS 3 1764, and so feels
091404 -         the KM project is too "off the wall," or too difficult for
091405 -         someone without a lot of polish, ref SDS 3 9144, or maybe they
091406 -         just prefer to give the money to the regulars, even though
091407 -         they don't have a clue how to create useful KM, because it is
091408 -         hard to do, as Paul noted on 000405, ref SDS 9 4611, but they
091409 -         know how to write up a good proposal with references, use
091410 -         cases, classes, commas and semicolons.
091412 -            ..
091413 -           [On 000423 Eric notes Doug has not been successful relying
091414 -           on grants in the past. ref SDS 23 3077
091416 -            ..
091417 -           [On 000503 Jack Park had similar experience applying for
091418 -           grant from NIH. ref SDS 26 3025
091420 -            ..
091421 -           [On 000509 Paul relates experience being turned down by NSF
091422 -           for grant, and concludes this is not an effective revenue
091423 -           source for major breakthroughs. ref SDS 27 4902
091424 -         ..
091425 -         Would it be okay for people to charge for using KM
091426 -         capability, if anyone whats to use it, and can't get it
091427 -         anywhere else?
091429 -          ..
091430 -         If KM capability does not add value to the work, non-payment
091431 -         might make sense.  But, if KM improves the earning capacity
091432 -         and lives of people, why shoudn't a portion of added value
091433 -         redound to the person, or persons who provide the capability?
091434 -         If it does not how will future innovations be developed?  We
091435 -         have to feed the horse to pull the wagon.
091437 -            ..
091438 -           [On 000423 Eric makes similar point. ref SDS 23 2214
091439 -     ..
091440 -     It would be better for individuals in my opinion interested
091441 -     in making money as part of this effort to either...
091442 -
091443 -         a.  be funded by grants individually or through a non-profit
091444 -             like the Bootstrap Alliance, ref DRT 1 0780
091445 -
091446 -             See above on grants. ref SDS 0 3900
091448 -              ..
091449 -             Question -- Why should profitable organizations be
091450 -             dependent upon non-profit organizations for capabilities
091451 -             to increase innovation that increases profits?
091453 -              ..
091454 -         b.  be funded by companies as employees (or contractors) and
091455 -             use and improve the DKR as part of their job to increase
091456 -             the companies efficiency (at the home company or on loan a
091457 -             Bootstrap alliance participant), ref DRT 1 2166,
091458 -             ..
091459 -         c.  provide services as a RedHat/DigitalCreations/
091460 -             VALinux style company (installation, training, hosting,
091461 -             security analysis, customization) to companies to increase
091462 -             the companies efficiency using DKR technology, or (less
091463 -             desirably), ref DRT 1 3332
091465 -              ..
091466 -             Question, Comment -- On 000411 RedHat is cited in a report
091467 -             that open source ventures are having difficulty making
091468 -             money. ref SDS 14 6935
091469 -
091470 -               [On 000423 Eric Armstrong cites same evidence.
091471 -               ref SDS 23 5280
091473 -              ..
091474 -         d.  provide proprietary add ons to the core distribution.
091475 -             ref DRT 1 5166
091476 - ..
091477 - Paul suggests...
091478 -
091479 -     Zope business model for a good example of Open Source
091480 -     ref DRT 1 1612
091481 -
091482 -         http://www.zope.org
091483 -
091484 -         http://www.digicool.com/
091486 -        ..
091487 -       [On 000427 Zope proposed for webmail system. ref SDS 25 4836
091489 -      ..
091490 -     Best Open Source license choices are...
091491 -
091492 -          •  BSD-ish, (non-viral); or
091493 -          •  GPL (viral)
091494 -
091495 -        [On 000423 Jeff Miller comments. ref SDS 23 3055
091497 -      ..
091498 -     Given the pro-business stance of the Bootstrap Alliance, Paul
091499 -     suggests BSD-ish is the way to go (or for the more cautious,
091500 -     something like IBM's public license -- but prefers BSDish or
091501 -     Python-ish.).
091502 -
091503 -        [On 000524 Paul submits information on Pointrel Data Repository
091504 -        system he developed using Python. ref SDS 28 0584
091506 -      ..
091507 -     Paul suggests other "Open Source" licenses he might accept....
091508 -
091509 -
091510 -         http://www.opensource.org/licenses/
091511 -
091512 -     ...some of which impose other restrictions, none with the
091513 -     commercial clause described in Eric's letter on 000421.
091514 -     ref SDS 21 6030
091515 -
091516 -
091518 -  ..
0916 -
0917 -
0918 - 2217 received letter from Jon Winters
0919 -
091901 - Received ref DRT 2 0001 from Jon Winters concurring with Paul's
091902 - analysis that argues for using an Open Source business model for DKR
091903 - development.
091905 -  ..
091906 - Jon says the fastest way to drive away talented developers is to say
091907 - you're open source when you don't really understand what its all
091908 - about. ref DRT 2 4788  This aligns with Paul's objections to initial
091909 - langauge, reported above. ref SDS 0 3050
091910 -
091911 -
091912 -
091913 -
091914 -
091915 -
091916 -
091917 -
091918 -
0920 -